9 replies to this topic

[Renegade]

I completely understand why the AI gets such a huge economic boost, but it seems so unfair. It's not fun to play against, it's so annoying.

 

Even on normal, the AI is so ridiculous. I had a super great early game, I colonized a lot of planets, tons of asteroids to harvest resources from, I was doing really well. I got a nice basic balanced fleet set up and the resources were flowing in. After I feel like I have enough ships I start building my SMAC ring, coupled with an anchor station in the middle and a few hangar defenses to really get a nice concrete defense going.

 

Then, the AI warps in and they already have a titan and a massive fleet set up. How is this fair?! My fleet is barely able to beat out the AI, and that's with the super expensive SMAC ring and anchor stations going. Then, just a few minutes later they're back again, and completely steamroll my defenses since I haven't even had enough time to rebuild fully. 

 

Keep in mind, I haven't even gotten 8/8 yet, and the AI has a titan coupled with a decently sized fleet. Normally to get my titan set up I have to sit back, wait a LONG ASS time for my resources to accumulate while BARELY spending anything on ships/research, and THEN i can finally start getting it built. Usually I won't even attempt to build a titan unless I have a super great concrete defense that I know will last awhile. And with all this time spent on saving, my fleet barely grows any so I'm usually doing this by the end of the game.. 

 

This happens seemingly every single game. I have no idea how they are able to get a titan going so fast, WITH a massive fleet, AND they somehow have global map presence. Being just a computer, they can micromanage many fleets without trouble, it's so difficult to outplay them since they are able to spend their massive resource bonuses on tons of upgrades, ships, etc. Roughly ~1k credits every minute, By the end of the game they had 10x the amount of credits as me, 5~6x the amount of titanium as me, and around 3x the amount of Deuterium as me. Seriously? This is just on normal difficulty. Am I doing something wrong? Is it just me? I admit sometimes I mess up my early game, but I should not be punished even for having a good early game. I balanced my research, fleet, and economic spending. I wasn't spending too much on everything, I wasn't being greedy with SMACs, this is so frustrating to play against.

 

Please, am I doing something wrong? What should I be doing early game? Usually the first 2 things I research is the trade station and economy. I make sure to keep building fleet while researching appropriate upgrades, I always have a nice balanced fleet, I'm at a loss here. The AI is super unfair to play against. It seems like I can't do anything except turtle super hardcore, disregarding all my upgrades for a big SMAC wall. This usually works at repelling the ai. But it's so boring. It slows and drags the game down a ton. I feel like I make no progress.

 

I'm getting really flustered. It FEELS like I'm doing everything right, why do I keep getting smashed? The AI seemingly always have a MUCH bigger fleet than me no matter what I do. 

[SiRD31M0S]

Not really true. Depending on the size of the map, expanding too much into too many planets you won't be able to defend is a huge money sink in the early game that can easily cripple you. Turtling works as long as you have a tanky enough fleet to take the hits while ODPs mop the floor with the alien bastards. You absolutely, unconditionally NEED good infrastructure to replace your losses (temperate/large planets work as great border worlds for this reason), but it works.

 

Balanced research isn't much of a benefit either, so early.  I usually shoot for three civic stations (four if I have the extra space) for basic economy and the early warning research, and six military stations for most of the capital ships and good weaponry. Your fleet is extremely important. If you let it stagnate, you die. Start fleet supply upgrades when you aren't building or replacing assets. If you think you'll soon need the revenue that increasing your fleet size will dock you, capital supply upgrades are always a good thing.

[Renegade]

Not really true. Depending on the size of the map, expanding too much into too many planets you won't be able to defend is a huge money sink in the early game that can easily cripple you. Turtling works as long as you have a tanky enough fleet to take the hits while ODPs mop the floor with the alien bastards. You absolutely, unconditionally NEED good infrastructure to replace your losses (temperate/large planets work as great border worlds for this reason), but it works.

 

Balanced research isn't much of a benefit either, so early.  I usually shoot for three civic stations (four if I have the extra space) for basic economy and the early warning research, and six military stations for most of the capital ships and good weaponry. Your fleet is extremely important. If you let it stagnate, you die. Start fleet supply upgrades when you aren't building or replacing assets. If you think you'll soon need the revenue that increasing your fleet size will dock you, capital supply upgrades are always a good thing.

Dang, I must've been playing this mod wrong then. I've been told to expand to as much planets as possible early on to get a big econ boost, but I realized now that I've probably been spending so much on economy early on. 

[SiRD31M0S]

I wouldn't say "wrong." Aggressive expansion is important; you just have to know what you can get away with, which is basically a trial and error thing for a lot of people, myself included. Better players than me can probably go full ham on everything. Playing more conservatively has just helped me adapt better to the AI, is all.

[Unikraken]

Unfortunately there isn't a great amount of nuance with regards to making the AI good. We can either have the AI we had in 0.75, which was bad, or the beast we have now.

[Second Chance]

I prefer kinda dumb over SKYNET, or perhaps Cylons are a more appropriate metaphor, seeing how most of my games are a recreation of the Fall of the 12 Colonies. I really want to like this mod, but at the current state the AI is in, its just not playable and very far from fun. I hope you guys can tone it down in future iterations.

[Alux]

I prefer kinda dumb over SKYNET, or perhaps Cylons are a more appropriate metaphor, seeing how most of my games are a recreation of the Fall of the 12 Colonies. I really want to like this mod, but at the current state the AI is in, its just not playable and very far from fun. I hope you guys can tone it down in future iterations.

While yes, the AI, for lack of a more succinct word, is retarded, this is the fault of the hardcoded AI behavior, the only way the AI will awaken is if they are given a big boost a of resources and civie tech to get them moving, even then, the AI is retarded, difficulty affects resources given, not intelligence, and if you focus choke points and build a sizable fleet, you will survive, and learn the combat system.

[Second Chance]

While yes, the AI, for lack of a more succinct word, is retarded, this is the fault of the hardcoded AI behavior, the only way the AI will awaken is if they are given a big boost a of resources and civie tech to get them moving, even then, the AI is retarded, difficulty affects resources given, not intelligence, and if you focus choke points and build a sizable fleet, you will survive, and learn the combat system.

Well if that's the case then, why is the playing field not even then and we as players given the same resource boost and research technology to balance it all out instead of the Sisyphean uphill battle many of us are facing? That might do the job to curb people's frustrations.

[SiRD31M0S]

its just not playable

Play Covenant.

I prefer kinda dumb over SKYNET

When people say the AI is retarded, they mean it does literally nothing without its boosts. It might take a planet or two with its starter capitals and then never build anything.

Well if that's the case then, why is the playing field not even

The AI can't build fleets worth shit. It can swarm, but it has no concept of nuance, making it easy prey for even mediocre end-game fleets. Whether you realize it or not, what you're asking for is that the player be totally unstoppable.

I need to put together a compilation of all the tips floating around this place.

[Renegade]

Guys, I tried playing a little bit differently and now I'm doing a lot better against the AI now. Basically, instead of expanding super aggressively and burning all my resources, I take just the right number of planets (6~8) and focus on defense over economy a lot more. I'm surviving AI superblobs all the time now, it just seems at the moment the game rewards defense and counter attacks over trying to win against the AI with pure strength.