32 replies to this topic

[Lord Stark]

Factions and Titans:

 

Here's a suggestion for Titans as well as factions in the mod as 

well as the possible inclusion of hero units.  

 

 

Covenant Separatists:

 

Lore: The Arbiter Thel 'Vadam is widely considered to be the greatest diplomat in the galaxy, many of the remaining Shipmasters and Kaidons have rallied behind him in absence of the Covenant High Council.  The Arbiter's rule is by no means absolute however, with many warlords and cultist leaders rising in rebellion against him and his new Sangheili Empire. 

 

Relationship Bonus: +UNSC, +URF

 

Titan:

Sublime Transcendence (Super Destroyer)

One of the last of the fearsome plot device-class Super-Carriers, the Sublime Transcendence is the flagship of Imperial Admiral Xytan 'Jar Wattinr.

 

Abilities:

Refuel and Resupply: Repairs vessels in the vacinity of the Super-Carrier.

 

Deploy Corvettes: The Super-Carrier has a complement of 5 SDV-class heavy that it can deploy to assist in sieging worlds.

 

Cloak: The plot device can conceal itself from enemy detection with active camouflage.

 

Covenant Plot(device)ing: The plot device stablizes slipspace, allowing entire fleets to slipspace to its location.  

 

Usage:  This unit has heavy shields but less powerful weapons than any of the other Titans.  Above all others this ship is meant to be at the center of fleets.  Its still a Titan, so it can solo medium sized fleets (as in canon), but head to head with another Titan it goes down (after a long battle because of its shields and armor.

 

 

Possible Hero Unit: 

Shadow of Intent:

Commanded by Shipmaster Rtas 'Vadum, this vessel has served as Arbiter Thel 'Vadam's flagship for decades.

Ability:

Evening the Fight: Shipmaster Rtas 'Vadum's tactical genius allows him to maximize the effectiveness of vessels in the gravity well. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Covenant Remnant:

 

Relationship Bonus: -UNSC, +Covenant Remnant, +URF

 

Titan Mantle's Approach: 

The Didact's personal flagship was once the fastest and most heavily armed vessel in the Forerunner fleet.  Now it is the single most powerful starship in the galaxy.

 

Abilities: 

Endurance of Will: The Didact's flagship engages in self repair.

 

The Composer: Mantle's Approach composes the population of the planet it is bombarding, transforming them into resources.

 

Promethean Knights: Teleports Promethean Knights into the target vessel, disrupting critical systems. 

 

Particle Barrage: Diverts power from its shields into a powerful barrage

of Particle Cannons.

 

Useage: This Titan is solely a combat vessel, it has crazy endurance, crazy firepower and is great at bombarding.  Its disadvantage is that its defenses against bombers is pretty mimimal and its complement of sentinals isn't all that great.   

 

 

Can Only be constructed at Requiem.

 

 

Possible Hero Units: 

 

Song of Retribution:

The flagship of Jul 'Mdama the Didact's Hand and Supreme Commander of the Covenant remnant.  

Abilites: 

Typical CAS abilities.  

 

Gift of the Forerunner:

Dr. Halsey's half of the Janus Key allows for the detection of Forerunner

artifacts in the galaxy.  

 

 

 

 

 

UNSC: 

 

Relationship Bonus: +Covenant Separatists, -Covenant Remnant 

 

Titan Infinity: 

The cumination of human achievement and flagship of the UNSC fleet, and Headquarters of the Spartan Branch.

 

Abilities: 

 

Spartan Branch: Spartan command dispatches teams to capture enemy vessels and sabotage enemy worlds.

 

The Word is Given:  Infinity deploys its Strident-class sub vessels.

 

Forerunner Engines: Forerunner engines allow Infinity to make a pinpoint slipspace jump in the gravity well. 

 

FLEETCOM: Infinity is able to coordinate the fire of the entire UNSC fleet, increasing their effecitveness by 30%.  

 

Huragok Engineering: Adds temporary shields to the UNSC ships surrounding it.  (Eh not really necessary)

 

 

Useage:  This Titan is the jack of all trades, but is the master of none.  It has brilliant fleet support, and excellent firepower.  But its fleet support is lesser than the Super Carrier (should you include it), and its firepower is less than the Mantle's Approach.  Huragok Engineering is incredible when used at the centeer of a fleet.  It allows them more time to survive through Covenant Phase 2.

 

Additional Ability: Mobile Rulership-UNSC CENTCOM transfers to Infinity, allowing Humanity to endure even in the event of Earth falling.

 

Possible Hero Units: 

Admiral Preston J. Cole

UNSC Everest

 

Lord Hood:

(Possibly an Autumn-class)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

United Rebel Front: 

Relationship Bonus: -UNSC, +Covenant Remnant

 

Faction Bonus: 

Black Market; able to purchase Covenant Vessels 

Pirate Alliegence; Able to make an alliegence with the Jackal Pirate Fleet (similar to the Vasari fleet return ability)

 

Titan: Modified Super-Destroyer

This is a partly fanon concept, but during Thursday War Staffan Sentske said he could get a battlecruiser if he wanted.  I figured if they could get that, why not a Super-Destroyer?

 

Abilities:

 

Pinpoint Jump: Allows the vessel to automatically jump to the edge of the gravity well.

 

Terrorist Strike:  Deploys Insurrectionist saboteurs reducing the health of orbital structures, the planet, and reducing income.

 

Other Super-Destroyer ability

 

Useage:  This titan is, like the Innie faction supposed to be a guerilla faction.  Its specifically designed to get in destroy infrastructure and get out

 

Faction Special Bonus:  Cannot be defeated by conquering their home planet.

 

Possible Hero Units:

Jacob Jiles- Beatrice

Staffan Sentzke- CCS-class

[Cole Protocol]

THE CSO WILL NOT BE IN THE MOD.

aside from that, i like the layout. some good ideas, but the heros are a stretch.

[David0425]

nice job but hero units arent in the mod they were already discussed.

[Lord Stark]

 

THE plot device WILL NOT BE IN THE MOD.

aside from that, i like the layout. some good ideas, but the heros are a stretch.

 

Which is exactly why I said or the Super-Destroyer.  
 

That being said...I don't know why everyone is okay with the Mantle's Approach, but not the plot device.  

[Fleet Admiral agigabyte]

The plot device is: Unrealistic for that size of an empire, just an assault carrier, and was randomly introduced, with no back story. The one super carrier in GoO was NOT a plot device.



EDIT: Why is the Arby fac against the UNSC??

[Cmdr Daefaron]

The plot device is: Unrealistic for that size of an empire, just an assault carrier, and was randomly introduced, with no back story. The one super carrier in GoO was NOT a plot device.

EDIT: Why is the Arby fac against the UNSC??

 

Supercarriers are described as being a good chunk of the defense fleet of High Charity. We don't even know the size of the Covenant nor how many of them there are. The ONLY plot device complains I can truly get behind is that the Ascendant Justice supposedly was one. Because if it was, how would a UNSC frigate reactor help any? How do we know that one wasn't a plot device? IIRC, it was destroyed with the rest of the fleet by the Nova Bomb. Yes, it could use tweaking (I found one which makes sense and looks good) but why would it be crazy for them to use the same hull type when the CRS, CCS, and RCS all use the exact same hull shape while being varying sizes? However, I simply agree that the plot device should not appear in the mod. Infact, the Mantle's Approach and some of the other forerunner ships would have to be scaled down to fit the maps alongside the UNSC and Covenant ships. The plot device simply is too large to realistically fit into gravity wells of planets with the current scaling unless they made everything else smaller. So I support and understand them not using it.

 

Also, he does put that Arbiters faction as a relationship boost with UNSC.

 

 

 

Personally, the URF idea seems interesting, especially if it focused on them not having much to work with. Modified/salvaged ship that uses both UNSC and Covenant weapons (UNSC PD, perhaps some missiles and fewer plasma torpedos, etc).would be interesting to see. However, I can understand if the mod makers wouldn't want to do that in the current timeframe of their plans to work on items in the project.

[sloosecannon]

This is why the CSO will never appear:



Bungie did a lazy job of modeling, or in this case, not modeling it. They resized the Assault Carrier. Also, it's far too game-breaking to include. When you fight the Covenant, they're supposed to be beatable. It would smash everything. So will the Mantle's Approach, but that's almost expected when you fight a Forerunner. Plus, the Forerunner faction is built around taking forever, and we mean forever ]to get its high level ships out.

[Demosthenes]

I like these ideas minus the plot device and URF faction.  The rebels are silly.  They never bombarded a planet into submission, destroyed an enemy fleet, or built a significant fleet of their own.

 

I doubt heroes will ever be in the mod but I really liked your ideas in that department.

[Death]

Which is exactly why I said or the Super-Destroyer.  
 

That being said...I don't know why everyone is okay with the Mantle's Approach, but not the plot device.  

Though I agree with what you are saying (if Bungie had just made a unique enough model this probably would not be as big an issue), this was answered in my topic about Mantle's Approach.

 

http://www.sinsofthe...ed-for-the-mod/

[Unikraken]

You know that late game lag you get when you're fighting more than one opponent? We include more than 2 or 3 factions and that will increase significantly. You'll crash more often. You'll get mini-dumps. There will be ships that are totally broken with regard to balance. SotP is a very finely tuned machine. We're bringing you the UNSC and Covenant for now, with maybe the Forerunners later when we have time. Are you a human rebel? You decide that when you start the game. Are you Covenant loyalists or separatists? Whatever you choose in your mind when you start that map. Someone else can come along later on and texture and model 4 or 6 factions that they scrape together out of the Halo universe. We're here to bring you as perfect as possible the Human-Covenant War and extra factions that require one to bend/break the canon to make them formidable enough to stand on their own is a distraction from that. You can either have a highly polished, balanced, and competitive machine or you can have a blob of factions where there is always one faction that is too powerful and needs tweaking, forever.

 

Quality over quantity is our approach.

[Cmdr Daefaron]

This is why the plot device will never appear:


Bungie did a lazy job of modeling, or in this case, not modeling it. They resized the Assault Carrier. Also, it's far too game-breaking to include. When you fight the Covenant, they're supposed to be beatable. It would smash everything. So will the Mantle's Approach, but that's almost expected when you fight a Forerunner. Plus, the Forerunner faction is built around taking forever, and we mean forever ]to get its high level ships out.

I agree, it's why I like a variant I found on Deviantart which added hull sections along the sides (basically removing the gap beneath the neck entirely). But really, calling them lazy for resizing counts toward 343 just as easily with the CRS light cruiser in halo 4 . It's the CCS reduced down to 300 meters. But, I'm completely in agreement that it shouldn't appear in the mod as a unit because of it's sheer scale and probably weapon loadout. Only way I'd see it appearing would be like a variant of dead asteroid, with the ship acting as the planet. But that won't happen and I have no problems with it .

 

I like these ideas minus the plot device and URF faction.  The rebels are silly.  They never bombarded a planet into submission, destroyed an enemy fleet, or built a significant fleet of their own.

 

I doubt heroes will ever be in the mod but I really liked your ideas in that department.

They certainly loved their nuking of civilians. Happened all throughout the war including after the Covenant appeared. And if Kilo 5 books are to be trusted, are planning to continue. Now fleet wise, we know of a few cases where they pieced together a good sized fleet from stolen and salvaged ships. And Cole's girlfriend headed a proper combat fleet against the UNSC and later the Covenant (IIRC, that fleet when it fought the Covenant was described as having ship types the UNSC had not seen before). If the focus on their ships was "Stolen and salvaged" I think it'd work decently. Civilian ships refitted with missiles and PD guns. However, let's just focus on getting an awesome UNSC and Covenant out.

 

 

 

 

You know that late game lag you get when you're fighting more than one opponent? We include more than 2 or 3 factions and that will increase significantly. You'll crash more often. You'll get mini-dumps. There will be ships that are totally broken with regard to balance. SotP is a very finely tuned machine. We're bringing you the UNSC and Covenant for now, with maybe the Forerunners later when we have time. Are you a human rebel? You decide that when you start the game. Are you Covenant loyalists or separatists? Whatever you choose in your mind when you start that map. Someone else can come along later on and texture and model 4 or 6 factions that they scrape together out of the Halo universe. We're here to bring you as perfect as possible the Human-Covenant War and extra factions that require one to bend/break the canon to make them formidable enough to stand on their own is a distraction from that. You can either have a highly polished, balanced, and competitive machine or you can have a blob of factions where there is always one faction that is too powerful and needs tweaking, forever.

 

Quality over quantity is our approach.

Well said. It's why in the Q&A I asked about diplomancy research. You can set up your matches with roleplay themes if you wish, or simply not fuss over the details and go into humans vs aliens war .

[Lord Stark]

You know that late game lag you get when you're fighting more than one opponent? We include more than 2 or 3 factions and that will increase significantly. You'll crash more often. You'll get mini-dumps. There will be ships that are totally broken with regard to balance. SotP is a very finely tuned machine. We're bringing you the UNSC and Covenant for now, with maybe the Forerunners later when we have time. Are you a human rebel? You decide that when you start the game. Are you Covenant loyalists or separatists? Whatever you choose in your mind when you start that map. Someone else can come along later on and texture and model 4 or 6 factions that they scrape together out of the Halo universe. We're here to bring you as perfect as possible the Human-Covenant War and extra factions that require one to bend/break the canon to make them formidable enough to stand on their own is a distraction from that. You can either have a highly polished, balanced, and competitive machine or you can have a blob of factions where there is always one faction that is too powerful and needs tweaking, forever.

 

Quality over quantity is our approach.

 

I understand and completely respect that.  The work you guys have put into this mod has really built a strong awesome community.  The reason I suggested sub factions is that the only changed unit would be the Titans of the respective fields and for the URF the ability to hire Covenant pirates.   Again though, these are just suggestions.  If any at all are taken I'd be pretty honored. 

 

 

 

The plot device is: Unrealistic for that size of an empire, just an assault carrier, and was randomly introduced, with no back story. The one super carrier in GoO was NOT a plot device.



EDIT: Why is the Arby fac against the UNSC??

 

 

It isn't.  And yes it is.  Its even referred to as a Fleet Carrier.  It can literally carry a fleet.

Also if Truth referred to the loss of 500 ships and the Hierophant a "minor setback" and a warlord at the edge of Covenant space could mass a fleet of 200+ as well as a Super-Carrier.  Why would it be unrealistic? 

 

 

 

This is why the plot device will never appear:



Bungie did a lazy job of modeling, or in this case, not modeling it. They resized the Assault Carrier. Also, it's far too game-breaking to include. When you fight the Covenant, they're supposed to be beatable. It would smash everything. So will the Mantle's Approach, but that's almost expected when you fight a Forerunner. Plus, the Forerunner faction is built around taking forever, and we mean forever ]to get its high level ships out.

 

Well in my suggestions it'd be significantly downscaled.  And it'd be roughly equal to Infinity, with Infinity having the edge in armament, and the Super-Carrier in shielding.  Mantle's Approach as per canon would be ridiculously gamebreaking, it can canonically shrug off Earth's ODPs firing at it probably simultaneously.  It'd probably have to have 1,000,000 HP and Shields +instantly regenerating abilities.  Even Infinity's main batteries barely scratched it.  

 

 

 

[Unikraken]

CSO will never be in SotP.

[Lord Stark]

plot device will never be in SotP.

K, still curious on your thoughts of replacing the Forerunner faction with the Covenant Remnant.  

 

Not arguing for it anymore, but I am not quite sure why people think the plot device is lazy...in real life Super-Carriers look exactly like upscaled aircraft carriers.  I mean hell even the Super Star Destroyer is basically an upscaled Star Destroyer.

[SPECTRE]

K, still curious on your thoughts of replacing the Forerunner faction with the Covenant Remnant.  

 

Not arguing for it anymore, but I am not quite sure why people think the plot device is lazy...in real life Super-Carriers look exactly like upscaled aircraft carriers.  I mean hell even the Super Star Destroyer is basically an upscaled Star Destroyer.

There are very few carriers in service in comparison with super carriers. Most V/STOL carriers such as HMS illustrious, are designed to operate in very shallow water, they're draft is a hell of a lot less than the Nimtz, If i remember correctly, nimtz is not only banned in most ports because its nuclear powered, but also because of its size.

[Lord Stark]

There are very few carriers in service in comparison with super carriers. Most V/STOL carriers such as HMS illustrious, are designed to operate in very shallow water, they're draft is a hell of a lot less than the Nimtz, If i remember correctly, nimtz is not only banned in most ports because its nuclear powered, but also because of its size.

There are recorded "dozens of Super-Carriers" in the High Charity defense fleet at the Covenant's peak.  I doubt that we have seen even two dozen CASes on screen.  Also the plot device'd probably have a similar docking restriction...the thing certainly couldn't dock at Unyielding Hierophant's docking ring its the size of the station.  

[SPECTRE]

There are recorded "dozens of Super-Carriers" in the High Charity defense fleet at the Covenant's peak.  I doubt that we have seen even two dozen CASes on screen.  Also the plot device'd probably have a similar docking restriction...the thing certainly couldn't dock at Unyielding Hierophant's docking ring its the size of the station.  

Oh no i meant in real life.

Can you imagine a plot device in the grav well of an asteroid?

[Stephan-338]

I think the differences between an SSD and a SD are massive, not just the size, but the entire model is different, yeah, it's still a triangle if you look at it from up and the bridge looks the same

 

But here you can clearly see massive differences

Spoiler

 

 

And yeah, A plot device would be way too big for it, and if you made it smaller, then why bother adding it? Then it'll just be a slightly bigger CAS but with more weapons

[Lord Stark]

I think the differences between an SSD and a SD are massive, not just the size, but the entire model is different, yeah, it's still a triangle if you look at it from up and the bridge looks the same

 

But here you can clearly see massive differences

Spoiler

 

 

And yeah, A plot device would be way too big for it, and if you made it smaller, then why bother adding it? Then it'll just be a slightly bigger CAS but with more weapons

True.  I did forget about the awesome city-scape on it.  

 

 

On-topic:  What does everyone think about the URF.  In Escalation they are seeming to be a rising power.

[Stephan-338]

I don't think they're that powerful really, but somebody that does have a lot of influence is backing them