41 replies to this topic

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

As I understand a lot of people are unhappy when an opposing play creates a lot of eions and thus spams the strike fighters. While I do have some sympathy to those who are suffering from I also find their complaint a bit , unneeded since they can create a CHEAP AND FAST TO PRODUCE VESSEL CALLED THE MAKO, that happens to be quite effective at reducing strike craft into nothing more than pieces of debris floating in the vacuum of space. All you really have to do is create two fleets when you are moving your ships, one which contains your general combat ships that will be doing most of the fighting and what not, and a second fleet of anti-strikecraft mako's and set them to a wide cohesion and have them keep pace with the first fleet so they can provide adequate AA cover. While I understand that this doesn't neccessarily stop people from spamming eions it does however make spamming eions less cost effective since their fighters and bombers are getting ripped up by the far cheaper Mako's and may make them reconsider spamming such an expensive support ship.

[Emberblaque]

Before this I was worried that the Eion's needed to be nerfed, but this is a really good point. There's a clear, cheap, quickly produced counter to this very common strategy. Eion's more expensive than a Halcyon, and requires more military labs to research for a marginally higher amount of strikecraft.

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

Before this I was worried that the Eion's needed to be nerfed, but this is a really good point. There's a clear, cheap, quickly produced counter to this very common strategy. Eion's more expensive than a Halcyon, and requires more military structures to research for a marginally higher amount of strikecraft.

Yup Mako's essentially can turn the tide of entire battle because they lay into sabres just as much as they do longswords, making them in my honest opinion a must when commencing large fleet battles, or assaulting a highly defended world that is swarming with hangars. Plus when they are well upgraded they can make it as though there never were any strike craft to begin with. It is really sad to see how this ship has been so overlooked in the past because people would just counter eion spam with eion spamming of their own making the games lag and a total bitch to deal with.

[m468]

Combine makos with a fighter screen and a well balanced fleet composed of shit that have point defense usually negates the effectiveness strike craft spam. Unless your computer cannot handle the large numbers of objects being used....

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

Combine makos with a fighter screen and a well balanced fleet composed of shit that have point defense usually negates the effectiveness strike craft spam. Unless your computer cannot handle the large numbers of objects being used....

Personally I don't think you can really screen anything in the game because the player can micro his ships to ignore the fighters and go right after the primary targets. but you are right in the sense that the game can't actually make those sort of choices on their own and will go after whatever is closest or micro their attacks rather poorly.

[m468]

Fighter scenes are meant to intercept inbound bombers I would love for my opponent to ignore my fighters

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

Fighter scenes are meant to intercept inbound bombers I would love for my opponent to ignore my fighters

Yes but you forget the Mako's man... You always keep the mako's at pace with the rest of the main fleet. No fighter will last long against a mako.

[Unikraken]

So I'll address this here, we've nerfed strikecraft in the most recent update to the internal build. We've decided to go the HHF route and go with few but powerful strikecraft. Squadrons of UNSC fighters and bombers are now groups of two craft. They move faster and are more powerful than they were before to compensate for some of that, but carrier spam is no longer a viable option. A varied fleet with some carriers is the better route.

Also this may lead to nerfs to anti-strikecraft abilities. We'll see.

[m468]

I use fighter to intercept bombers if the fleets are that close I'm not that worried about strike craft I'm thinking about getting my ships set right so I can pull the halo equivalent of crossing the "T" getting into a position where I can get the max firepower while my opponent cannot. Fighters are for bombers, and bombers for ships and defenses oh and mines spotted by prowlers....

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

So I'll address this here, we've nerfed strikecraft in the most recent update to the internal build. We've decided to go the HHF route and go with few but powerful strikecraft. Squadrons of UNSC fighters and bombers are now groups of two craft. They move faster and are more powerful than they were before to compensate for some of that, but carrier spam is no longer a viable option. A varied fleet with some carriers is the better route.

Also this may lead to nerfs to anti-strikecraft abilities. We'll see.

But if they are more powerful then wouldn't that just reinforce the need of anti-strikecraft ships like the mako? Because if the other ships can't put down the strike craft as fast and they are getting torn apart by the now more powerful models you would need a ship that can take them out and fast.

[Unikraken]

But if they are more powerful then wouldn't that just reinforce the need of anti-strikecraft ships like the mako? Because if the other ships can't put down the strike craft as fast and they are getting torn apart by the now more powerful models you would need a ship that can take them out and fast.

Well, the number of individual fighters and bombers is dropping, so AA may just shred them to pieces. I'm not working on a nerf or anything like that at the moment, I'm saying "test this so we can see how it goes". It make work out perfectly, or it may not.

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

Well, the number of individual fighters and bombers is dropping, so AA may just shred them to pieces. I'm not working on a nerf or anything like that at the moment, I'm saying "test this so we can see how it goes". It make work out perfectly, or it may not.

Personally it just seems like a bit of a unneeded modification since if you give them less strike but make them more powerful it really just balances out in the end since they are also faster now too. I think people should just learn how to click on the Mako button.

Could put it to a vote.

whether or not its worth reducing the strikecraft number and enhancing them in firepower and speed or if people should just the already highly effective counter known as the Mako.

[Unikraken]

Personally it just seems like a bit of a unneeded modification since if you give them less strike but make them more powerful it really just balances out in the end since they are also faster now too. I think people should just learn how to click on the Mako button.

Could put it to a vote.

whether or not its worth reducing the strikecraft number and enhancing them in firepower and speed or if people should just the already highly effective counter known as the Mako.

Let me reiterate this clearly: There are no current plans to nerf/buff AA capabilities. We have just buffed/nerfed strikecraft. That will require testing. Once testing has been done, we will know what needs to be buffed/nerfed/left alone. If everything works out perfectly, then we can all pat our backs and enjoy the game.

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

Let me reiterate this clearly: There are no current plans to nerf/buff AA capabilities. We have just buffed/nerfed strikecraft. That will require testing. Once testing has been done, we will know what needs to be buffed/nerfed/left alone. If everything works out perfectly, then we can all pat our backs and enjoy the game.

Fair enough.

[Defender0]

Heres my problem with the strikecraft nerf. it does not adress the problem of people making large groups of eions. The Eion itself should be harder to make, not the strikecraft. I feel that the Eion should get a nerf to its pricing so that they are more expensive, so that less squadrons are on the field, regardless of how many strikecraft are in those squadrons.

Now, to adress the mako corvette argument. This assumes you are against someone who micromanages, so keep this in mind. While makos are a good counter for strikecraft, lets say you are under attack at a planet where you dont have a fleet. You have an offensive fleet moving in to defend, but you also have factories at that planet being attacked. So you start making Makos. Those makos, once they are built, will become priority targets and will be attacked first, forcing you to spend more money and make more makos. eventually, those factories will become priority targets as well, and get destroyed. this means you lose your mako corvette building at that planet, and will need to make more at another planet to get them there effectively. Once those makos arrive out of slipspace, they will be targetted immediately and get destroyed. This entire time, the eions are just sitting there while their strikecraft do all the work.

This is why i believe that a nerf to the Eion itself, not its strikecraft, is better in the long run, because if we nerf strikecraft, we are nerfing the entire UNSC navy's air force.

Take this as you will, this is just how i feel. If we nerf strikecraft, i will grudgingly accept it, but i will not leave because of it. I love this mod too much to leave.

[ShadowOfIntent]

Put the Eion down the tech tree, 5 military labs instead of four, and make it a little bit more expensive.

[Unikraken]

Strikecraft were never a strong part of the UNSC's force projection. Their capability in the mod previously was way off canon. This change makes them a nice addition to a fleet, but not the main component, as things should be. If you disagree, I will always refer you to the canon and from the canon it must come to change my mind. If you just want carrier based fun, I'm sure there are mods to provide that, but our goal has always been to bring about the most accurate and best Halo mod for SoaSE.

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

Strikecraft were never a strong part of the UNSC's force projection. Their capability in the mod previously was way off canon. This change makes them a nice addition to a fleet, but not the main component, as things should be. If you disagree, I will always refer you to the canon and from the canon it must come to change my mind. If you just want carrier based fun, I'm sure there are mods to provide that, but our goal has always been to bring about the most accurate and best Halo mod for SoaSE.

I just think that people should use Mako's since they are there to deal with the strike craft threats..... and be sacrficial pawns to scout when you are to far away to call up a prowler quickly.

[Defender0]

Strikecraft were never a strong part of the UNSC's force projection. Their capability in the mod previously was way off canon. This change makes them a nice addition to a fleet, but not the main component, as things should be. If you disagree, I will always refer you to the canon and from the canon it must come to change my mind. If you just want carrier based fun, I'm sure there are mods to provide that, but our goal has always been to bring about the most accurate and best Halo mod for SoaSE.

In regards to canon, is there a general consensus on the ratio of carriers to the rest of the fleet? i would imagine it isnt that big, maybe 10% at the most

[TheOtherXtremeRoflcopter]

In regards to canon, is there a general consensus on the ratio of carriers to the rest of the fleet? i would imagine it isnt that big, maybe 10% at the most

I honestly thought that by time of the fall of reach there were less than that. Maybe at the most 10 carriers that were still on active patrol for the inner colonies.