86 replies to this topic

[Faced]

No no, I misworded that. I meant that Lord Stark's SD isn't canon. 

Ok, that makes sense. but neither is the Super Carrier for the UNSC.

[theblitz6794]

Yes it is. It's present at the fall of reach. The class names are made up by necessity. 

 

http://halo.wikia.co...SC_supercarrier

[Faced]

No, not the actually name and class and shit, the model. that's not cannon

[theblitz6794]

Well yes that's true but once again, by necessity. There is no necessity argument for the SD. 

[Faced]

Its frustrating we know, the Devs have to put up with our bickering and complaining haha

[Zero]

Upscaling a ship is not a titan requirement. There is no reason why a 2000m long ship should have a hard time dancing with Infinity when it has more armament than a 5km+ long ship.

[SPECTRE]

Also for endgame ships...they are making things up, otherwise Mantle's Approach would be larger than the gravity well.  My point is that if one Titan can be rescaled to fit the Titan size range why can't another?

 

Whatever was said about downscaling the mantles approach is different. Because of the way human eyesight works things are perceived wider and longer than they appear taller. On the scale of mantles approach if scaled down, the human eyes would be tricked into seeing something larger than it actually is, then when compared to other ships it would seem ok.

[Lord Stark]

If you read the forums, you'd realize Forerunner ships and MA are being scaled down for gameplay and practicality reasons. It's impossible to have them in the mod at their true size. The ships are just too big. They don't have to break canon for the SD, so they won't. 

 

The CAS is titan length. It just isn't a titan. The Infinity is also titan length and is a titan. Length means something but not everything.

 

http://halo.wikia.co...hip#cite_note-0

 

The battleship is 2,000m long. What else is there to say?

I am recommending the scaling up of the SD for gameplay and practicality reasons.  I am going only on aesthetics here.  It looks strange to have the flagship of your fleet look smaller than your flagship.  Hell even the author of Genesis felt that...which is exactly why the vessel doesn't even look like its 2kms there.  Most people thought it was a Super-Carrier at first because the vessel when scaled from the graphic novel was upwards of 5km.

http://www.halopedia...r-destroyer.jpg

[SPECTRE]

I am recommending the scaling up of the SD for gameplay and practicality reasons.  I am going only on aesthetics here.  It looks strange to have the flagship of your fleet look smaller than your flagship.  Hell even the author of Genesis felt that...which is exactly why the vessel doesn't even look like its 2kms there.  Most people thought it was a Super-Carrier at first because the vessel when scaled from the graphic novel was upwards of 5km.

http://www.halopedia...r-destroyer.jpg

Ooo forgot to mention its not an SD its a battleship, SD sounded too stupid so in the abridged edition it was changed to battleship.

[Lord Stark]

Upscaling a ship is not a titan requirement. There is no reason why a 2000m long ship should have a hard time dancing with Infinity when it has more armament than a 5km+ long ship.

Except...there is not even canon proof the Super-Destroyer is superior to the CAS-class.  

 

The CAS is cited as being a Class-Five flagship carrier found at the center of fleets, the only other vessel having that distinction is the plot device-class.  Canonically speaking the CAS can shrug off Mac rounds from Cairo Station, aka magnitudes more firepower than even Cole's fleet could muster.

 

Also it took around 60 vessels to even bring the carrier's shield's down.

[Faced]

It took 27 ships to destroy the Super Destroyer, if its shields didnt buckle under the amount of fire, it would've obliterated Cole's Fleet. It's probably more powerful than the plot device, The plot device can just absorb a lot of the hits. but don't forget, it was a "Carrier" and it was used to deploy it's forces upon Reach. The Super Destroyer was made to "Destroy" Fleets.

[Lord Stark]

It took 27 ships to destroy the Super Destroyer, if its shields didnt buckle under the amount of fire, it would've obliterated Cole's Fleet. It's probably more powerful than the plot device, The plot device can just absorb a lot of the hits. but don't forget, it was a "Carrier" and it was used to deploy it's forces upon Reach. The Super Destroyer was made to "Destroy" Fleets.

First off there's no way in hell its more powerful than the plot device.  It solo'd the Reach defense fleet, which we know is a minimum of 100 vessels I believe.

 

Also

Analysis of the First Battle of Earth:

Cortana: “Slipspace ruptures directly off our battle cluster."

Lord Hood: "Show me."

Cortana: "Fifteen Covenant capital ships holding position just outside the kill zone."

Fleet Admiral Harper (COM):  "This is Fleet Admiral Harper. We are engaging the enemy."

Lord Hood: "Negative, Admiral. Form a defensive perimeter around the cluster." (to Miranda Keyes) “Commander, get to your ship, link up with the fleet."

Keyes salutes.

Commander Keyes: "Yes, sir." (leaves)

Lord Hood: "You have the MAC gun, Cortana. As soon as they come in range, open up."

Cortana: "Gladly."

- Here we see clearly that Cortana is tracking the targets and as soon as they come in range she'll open fire on it.  Now we know that the S-MAC can "put a round clean through a Covenant Capital ship" what we do no know is what type of vessel.  I always thought it was a CCS, not necessarily a carrier."

 

Fleet Admiral Harper (COM): "First Echelon, you're with me, blanket those cruisers, take ‘em out one by one. Second Echelon, keep those carriers busy."

 

Here its pretty clear that it takes half of the fleet just to keep the Carriers busy.  So...4 Marathons and likely 34 frigates.  

 

Cortana (COM): "Registering all hostile vessels inside the kill zone. Thirteen cruisers, two Assault Carriers. I'm going loud!"

 

Fleet Admiral Harper (COM): "The carriers are breaking through, Sir! They're heading straight for the Cairo!"

The fleet cannot hold the carriers at bay.  Hell they couldn't even bring Regret's Carrier's shields down.

 

Lord Hood (COM): "Cortana! Concentrate your fire on the first carrier. Admiral, do what you can against the second."

Cortana is a smart AI with excellent targeting.  No way she was missing shots, not when she could down CCS-classes with the POA's inferior MAC, and especially not with the targets in range and closing.

 

Fleet Admiral Harper (COM): "Everyone, form up. Follow my lead!"

Here the ENTIRE FLEET now focuses fire on the second Carrier (remember now Hood specifically said for the Admiral to do what he can against the Second Carrier.

Cortana (COM): "The first carrier completely ignored us, Sir! Blew through the Malta's debris field and headed straight for Earth!"

Further proof that the Admiral wasn't focusing on the second carrier by this point was that right after he says this Regret's Carrier is already on its way past Earth, after shrugging off several SMAC rounds.  SMAC rounds are magnitudes more powerful than your ship mounted MACs mind you.

Commander Keyes: "The carrier's shield is down. I'm in position and ready for immediate assault."

So after an extended battle Harper's ENTIRE fleet only managed to bring the vessel's shield's down.  

 

 

Next we see of the battle we here is that the fleet is getting slaughtered at 8:06.  Frigates are going down left and right and the second carrier wrecks a Marathon.  More damning still is that it is very likely that once Regret's Carrier passed Cortana concentrated fire on the second.  So it took most of Harper's fleet + Cairo station...just to bring its shield's down. 

[sloosecannon]

First off there's no way in hell its more powerful than the CSO.  It solo'd the Reach defense fleet, which we know is a minimum of 100 vessels I believe.

We don't know that. Comparisons are pretty tough when you don't have solid data to base it off of.

[OMGWTFpost]

Yeah, not even sure what point you were trying to make there...

So basically, the issue on the CSO is closed...

I'm not gonna lock this thread beceause you guys can speculate on ideas about how we'll handle the Titan (Super Destroyer, for any who don't know), heck we might even use some of em. Next person who mentions the CSO outside of Off Topic will get their post deleted and will probably be banned for some period of time. We've really beat this dead horse to death. There's no point in even mentioning it.

And, it will be the Super Destroyer aside from a book or something creating a ship that would fit the role of the titan ideally AND a team member convincing the entire team to use that instead.
Basically, you're more likely to see lightning on the moon while winning all known lotteries and being elected president as a third-party write-in candidate. It's not going to happen.

 

@Faced: one of us ninja'd the other. You're fine. Removed the post though as it's no longer relevant.

[Lord Stark]

We don't know that. Comparisons are pretty tough when you don't have solid data to base it off of.

Yeah, not even sure what point you were trying to make there...

So basically, the issue on the plot device is closed...

I'm not gonna lock this thread beceause you guys can speculate on ideas about how we'll handle the Titan (Super Destroyer, for any who don't know), heck we might even use some of em. Next person who mentions the plot device outside of Off Topic will get their post deleted and will probably be banned for some period of time. We've really beat this dead horse to death. There's no point in even mentioning it.

And, it will be the Super Destroyer aside from a book or something creating a ship that would fit the role of the titan ideally AND a team member convincing the entire team to use that instead.
Basically, you're more likely to see lightning on the moon while winning all known lotteries and being elected president as a third-party write-in candidate. It's not going to happen.

 

@Faced: one of us ninja'd the other. You're fine. Removed the post though as it's no longer relevant.

Uhh I think you misread mypost.  I only mentioned the plot device in the first sentence.  The post was all about the CAS.  

[sloosecannon]

Uhh I think you misread mypost.  I only mentioned the CSO in the first sentence.  The post was all about the CAS.

Possiably.
I'm just making it crystal clear for everyone about this subject. So nobody should complain if they get posts deleted or worse.

[Lord Stark]

Possiably.
I'm just making it crystal clear for everyone about this subject. So nobody should complain if they get posts deleted or worse.

Makes sense.  My point was a Fleet of 8 Marathons and 72 frigates got slaughtered by 2 Assault Carriers and 13 cruisers with an SMAC backing them up.

[Death]

Yeah that topic seemed to do a number on the site or something...what even happened...

 

Anyway, is it possible that the hierarch's CAS flagships here could have had more powerful shielding and the like due to the obvious importance of the people they carried?

[Lord Stark]

Yeah that topic seemed to do a number on the site or something...what even happened...

 

Anyway, is it possible that the hierarch's CAS flagships here could have had more powerful shielding and the like due to the obvious importance of the people they carried?

What do you mean?  

 

And its possible but that doesn't explain why it took Harper's entire fleet and quite likely firepower from the Cairo to down the second carrier.  

 

Hell even in Halo: ODST, one of the ODSTs states "I take that back, Navy got its butt kicked."

[Death]

What do you mean?  

 

And its possible but that doesn't explain why it took Harper's entire fleet and quite likely firepower from the Cairo to down the second carrier.  

 

Hell even in Halo: ODST, one of the ODSTs states "I take that back, Navy got its butt kicked."

Well the other assault carrier wasn't transporting a hierarch but it was with his fleet, so it could still make sense for it to be somewhat more powerful than average since it indirectly was still protecting him.

[m468]

Ok the reason that Regret's ship got through is because all of the other ships covered it. Not to mention that Covenant boarding parties has destroyed two out of the three ODP's on top of that Harper's fleet was focused on the other CAS. The fleet was further reduced in firepower do to the CAS's bypassing the remaining ODP. The fleet could not use nukes without running the risk of disabling their last ODP. And remember it to destroy the Covenant Super-destroyer it to 27 ships concentrating their fire. 27+ MAC rounds (some ships may have had double MACs), all of the fleet's Archers timed to hit 0.1 seconds after the MACs impacted, and all of the fleet's nukes timed to hit 0.2 seconds after the MACs impacted. That is a lot of firepower and before that salvo the Super Destroyer was shrugging off hits from MACs and nukes alike. It took everything that those ships had to destroy the Covenant vessel.