64 replies to this topic

[CanadaMan7]

Yay for Hornet mines, nay for wonky cloaking, IMO.

I feel you. But they also get completely slaughtered everytime they go into any occupied planet, even if it's just militia. That also seems wonky.

[sloosecannon]

I feel you. But they also get completely slaughtered everytime they go into any occupied planet, even if it's just militia. That also seems wonky.

This. I'm still toying with some ideas on how to make them effective scouts without resorting to wonky cloaking

[Emberblaque]

I feel you. But they also get completely slaughtered everytime they go into any occupied planet, even if it's just militia. That also seems wonky.

Never thought about it like that. I always thought of it as a very poor attempt to fool human players, rather than something that would simulate the effects that cloaking would have on an AI's behavior. I am now officially for it.

[CanadaMan7]

Alright, then. Let's see if we can get an ability going that doesn't make us all lose our dignity.

Where are my coding interns at?

[sloosecannon]

So, there are a few ways I've come up with to do this.

1: Standard invuln/phase style cloaking.
Pros: Known method, AI ignores the ship
Cons: Klunky, wierd, human players and abilities aren't affected...

2: Sensor Ghosts ability - spawn a bunch of fake prowlers
Pros: Fools AI (theoretically), could even fool humans, doesn't run the risk of being too OP
Cons: Slightly unrealistic, AI response is questionable, may have no effect on a human player

3: Damage decrease ability - give a -75%ish incoming damage reduction (passively) to the prowler
Pros: Could be jusified in canon (The prowler can dodge shots taken at it (MAC or otherwise) due to its low mass, allowing for it to decrease damage), less micro-managing needed (compared to an active ability)
Cons: Could be very OP

Thoughts?

[CanadaMan7]

My first instinct right off the bat is that the third option is a no-go.

We just need to see if the other two can be implemented properly and then weigh the pros and con's of each.

[sloosecannon]

My first instinct right off the bat is that the third option is a no-go.
We just need to see if the other two can be implemented properly and then weigh the pros and con's of each.

I kinda like it. I may try the 3 out ingame and see which ones are better in actual use.
Worth noting that even a 75% reduction leaves a good 100+ damage from a single MAC, which is quite a threat to a ship with 500some hull.

[Defender0]

I think it would be between the second and third options. Second one makes sense as the prowler would be messing with enemy optics, and then getting away, while the third one actually does give it the impression of being harder to "see", which explains the higher dodge chance. It could also be argued that, in the time period of the mod, human based cloaking is not perfect and a ship can be detected, but not as well as a ship without cloaking.

[CanadaMan7]

I'm just worried about what players will do with a ship with a 75% dodge rate if we give it mines. But meh, give them all a try.

[sloosecannon]

I'm just worried about what players will do with a ship with a 75% dodge rate if we give it mines. But meh, give them all a try.

Hmm... true point there. I may have a solution for that though. Make it always auto cast and disable abilities, thus leading to the same result. I'll test stuff tomorrow...

[Defender0]

Hmm... true point there. I may have a solution for that though. Make it always auto cast and disable abilities, thus leading to the same result. I'll test stuff tomorrow...

So, with the stealth ability, are you saying that it disable all other abilities besides explore?

[sloosecannon]

So, with the stealth ability, are you saying that it disable all other abilities besides explore?

yep

[Defender0]

yep

If it works, i like that idea

[Bornstellaris]

Aren't prowlers typically very slow because they need to maintain stealth? I'd like to see a 40% speed decrease when the cloak is active and the cloak should be able to stay on indefiently, if it is possible to disable other abilities while cloaked. Imagine having a prowler just sitting on the edge of the gravity spying on the enemy's plans but being able to do nothing.

[Fleet Admiral agigabyte]

What Bornsteller said.

[Defender0]

Aren't prowlers typically very slow because they need to maintain stealth? I'd like to see a 40% speed decrease when the cloak is active and the cloak should be able to stay on indefiently, if it is possible to disable other abilities while cloaked. Imagine having a prowler just sitting on the edge of the gravity spying on the enemy's plans but being able to do nothing.

Agreed with the speed decrease, in canom, engine exhaust would reveal its position. Besides, theyre pretty fast currently, the speed decrease wouldnt be TOO detrimental anyway.

[KhevaKins]

But with the probe ability that isn't really needed. You wouldn't need to have the prowler sit on the edge of the gravity well.

[Defender0]

True, but it helps for it to move on to the next gravity well

[SPECTRE]

Aren't prowlers typically very slow because they need to maintain stealth? I'd like to see a 40% speed decrease when the cloak is active and the cloak should be able to stay on indefinitely, if it is possible to disable other abilities while cloaked. Imagine having a prowler just sitting on the edge of the gravity spying on the enemy's plans but being able to do nothing.

Totally and utterly wrong, Heat and energy emissions need to be below %70 (in a Royal navy Astute class sub which in halo equivalent does the same role as a prowler) but in space quote:

Newton's laws of motion are three physical laws that together laid the foundation for classical mechanics. They describe the relationship between a body and the forces acting upon it, and itsmotion in response to said forces. They have been expressed in several different ways over nearly three centuries,^[1] and can be summarized as follows:

1. First law: An object at rest remains at rest unless acted upon by a force. An object in motion remains in motion, and at a constant velocity, unless acted upon by a force. ^[2][3]
2. Second law: The acceleration of a body is directly proportional to, and in the same direction as, the net force acting on the body, and inversely proportional to its mass. Thus, F = ma, where F is the net force acting on the object, m is the mass of the object and a is the acceleration of the object.
3. Third law: When one body exerts a force on a second body, the second body simultaneously exerts a force equal in magnitude and opposite in direction to that of the first body.

So in space a vessel would only have to activate its engines or thrusters until it has reached the desired velocity, then it can shut them off and glide of the kinetic energy. That is until it needs to change direction or is impacted by an outside force. 
Back to your quote: any other activity they would do for example firing weapons. activating an active RADAR, SONAR Or SADAR would result in detection.
 

[Bornstellaris]

I'm sorry but I see no point in the bringing up of Newtons laws. I was stating that prowlers in Halo are known to move slowly because the technology that keeps them invisible from covie sensors cannot compensate for the maximum output of a prowlers engine.