127 replies to this topic

[Zero]

You are also right, I thought that too while looking at this image

Spoiler

 

Anyway they were scattered.

This looks inaccurate, too. Only because Installation 05 would be somewhere else besides the Orion Arm in the galaxy and Truth's ship managed to jump there. Now, granted Covenant ships and their slipspace drives are far more advanced than that of the UNSC. However, if an Assault Carrier can travel a fifth of the galaxy in the span of a month and it takes about a month for freighters to reach Harvest from Reach and given the fact that finding habitable planets is extremely rare, the distances would be much greater.

[Unikraken]

I don't think they played a defensive role, I think they played the only role they could play in that war, they just tried to save as many planets as possible. You can't attack someone that with half of your forces annihilates your entire fleet. Cole tried many times to go on the offensive, but he failed. He managed to take back Harvest, but it was a pyrrhic victory.

No, they didn't. Infact in "The Fall of Reach" UNSC's plan was to capture an enemy ship, go to the "Covenant homeworld" which didn't even exist, kidnap their leader to force a peace treaty. This, by the way, is another proof that they always tried to make the first move.

This was 20 years into the war. One very late first move.

[KhevaKins]

Did they even know where any Covenant planets were?

In Headhunters they are on a Covenant controlled world, Well behind enemy lines, it doesn't say whether it is a old human orld or a original covvie world or an unoccupied planet being used but I would assume it is a covvie planet ('well behind enemy lines' -quote). And the Spartan 3's are deployed to several established covvie bases.

Nova bomb obliterates covvie planet but that was an accident. After the war they discovered quite a few planets with tracking devices and what have you though.

[SternuS]

This looks inaccurate, too. Only because Installation 05 would be somewhere else besides the Orion Arm in the galaxy and Truth's ship managed to jump there. Now, granted Covenant ships and their slipspace drives are far more advanced than that of the UNSC. However, if an Assault Carrier can travel a fifth of the galaxy in the span of a month and it takes about a month for freighters to reach Harvest from Reach and given the fact that finding habitable planets is extremely rare, the distances would be much greater.

It seems pretty inaccurate to me too. Nonetheless, it is canon.

 

This was 20 years into the war. One very late first move.

How come UNSC turtled? How could they attack the Covenant? When your colonies are getting glassed each and every passing day and you're loosing ship after ship, fleet after fleet, how can you move on the offense when you have nothing to fight with? Did they abandon all the Outer Colonies? No, they didn't! Did they reunite all their fleets at Reach? No, they didn't! When the Fleet of Particular Justice arrived at Reach, they didn't even call back all of them; their armies were so scattered they managed to regroup only the 40% of them. Were those ships hiding or defending another planet or were they gathered at some strategic point, I don't know.

[Deathscythe1992]

 Were those ships hiding or defending another planet or were they gathered at some strategic point, I don't know.

Earth?

[Dianno5741]

the UNSC was scattered across all its colonies and it took weeks to get from one system to another. Reach recalled all ships in nearby systems that could make in there in a short time.

[SternuS]

the UNSC was scattered across all its colonies and it took weeks to get from one system to another. Reach recalled all ships in nearby systems that could make in there in a short time.

That's what I'm saying. They weren't turtling.

 

Earth?

Maybe, but probably not, as Reach was the fortress world before Earth.

[KhevaKins]

Maybe, but probably not, as Reach was the fortress world before Earth.

Earth was always a fortress world, even before the Covenant. Johnson says they were planning on building the SMACs before he joined up, well before first contact. Reach was the second most important and the biggest military installation.

[SternuS]

Earth was always a fortress world, even before the Covenant. Johnson says they were planning on building the SMACs before he joined up, well before first contact. Reach was the second most important and the biggest military installation.

"Before" because the Covenant had to pass through Reach before attacking Earth (and, btw, they thought Reach was the homeworld of Humanity). This' what Halsey said. Link.

[Deathscythe1992]

Earth was better defended.  I'm not sure how many ships were left to defend her, but Earth had at least 300 SMACs surrounding the planet.  In comparison Reach had 20.

[SternuS]

Earth was better defended.  I'm not sure how many ships were left to defend her, but Earth had at least 300 SMACs surrounding the planet.  In comparison Reach had 20.

And Regret managed to break through it with a fleet fifty times smaller. UNSC had like 8 Marathon and 60 or something Frigates, 300 SMACs, and yet they lost. If they turtled, they would've had like 50 Marathons, but they had 8. And they were conscious of how big was the Covenant fleet.

[Deathscythe1992]

And Regret managed to break through it with a fleet fifty times smaller. UNSC had like 8 Marathon and 60 or something Frigates, 300 SMACs, and yet they lost. If they turtled, they would've had like 50 Marathons, but they had 8. And they were conscious of how big was the Covenant fleet.

At the time of Sigma Octanus IV they only had 20 Marathons left.  And they didnt destroy every SMAC.  The Covenant destroyed two and damaged the Cairo, creating a gap for a couple ships (Regret's ship and one other) to break through.  I'm gonna say they turtled pretty hard at Earth, Reach only had more ships because it was the frontline outpost.  

 

Also I love having these discussions, but its probably better to have them in the Lore section.  

[Zero]

At the time of Sigma Octanus IV they only had 20 Marathons left.  And they didnt destroy every SMAC.  The Covenant destroyed two and damaged the Cairo, creating a gap for a couple ships (Regret's ship and one other) to break through.

Only Regret's carrier made it to Earth. Master Chief detonated the Covenant bomb inside the second assault carrier after a wing of Longswords cleared a hole along it's dorsal hull.

[SternuS]

At the time of Sigma Octanus IV they only had 20 Marathons left.  And they didnt destroy every SMAC.  The Covenant destroyed two and damaged the Cairo, creating a gap for a couple ships (Regret's ship and one other) to break through.  I'm gonna say they turtled pretty hard at Earth, Reach only had more ships because it was the frontline outpost.  

 

Also I love having these discussions, but its probably better to have them in the Lore section.  

 

But Hood sent the fleet to intercept the enemy. So you think that instead of assembling the remnants of their fleets at their homeworld, they should've sent them to attempt to regain control of Reach, with Particular Justice waiting for them? This sounds a bit nonesense to me. There's a difference between turtling and defending.

 

I think it's fine having them here, this would be a dead topic anyway.

[Deathscythe1992]

But Hood sent the fleet to intercept the enemy. So you think that instead of assembling the remnants of their fleets at their homeworld, they should've sent them to attempt to regain control of Reach, with Particular Justice waiting for them? This sounds a bit nonesense to me. There's a difference between turtling and defending.

 

I never said they should have tried to retake Reach?  I'm not sure what you meant by Hood sending the fleet.  In the opening of Halo 2 he ordered the fleet to stay near the SMAC battle cluster to defend the SMACs.

 

And Zero you are right, but both carriers made it past the SMACs, the chief just made sure that only one would descend all the way to earth.

[Bornstellaris]

 And Zero you are right, but both carriers made it past the SMACs, the chief just made sure that only one would descend all the way to earth.

"What if you miss?"

"I won't"

[SternuS]

I never said they should have tried to retake Reach?  I'm not sure what you meant by Hood sending the fleet.  In the opening of Halo 2 he ordered the fleet to stay near the SMAC battle cluster to defend the SMACs.

Well then, tell me what do you think they should've done instead of turtling. That's right, he defended the SMACs, he could've stayed behind them and wait for them to destroy some enemy vessels; just because you choose to not attack doesn't mean you turtle, you defend a position.

[m468]

He ordered the fleet to defend the SMACs because as was learned at Reach SMACs are VERY vulnerable in close combat . Havering the fleet next to the station discourages the Covenant from using short range slip-space jumps to get close, because said jumps leave Covenant ships without power for a short period of time.

[Sneer]

Hi my name is Sneer and I have a question not related to Covenant defenses and whether the UNSC did or didn't turtle.

 

Could somebody explain how the Forerunners will work in some more detail? I know the developers are doing their best with the Covenant right now and that the Forerunners are a long way off, but does anybody have any insight on them besides what's in-game so far?

[Emberblaque]

There's no plan yet, we're just about to start on art assets for the Forerunners to my knowledge, but Defender could probably spit some ideas at you that may or may not be in the final product because right now Dianno's put him in charge of designing them.